MLB 2025 Hall of Fame Ballot...

[posty 2,491]

2025 Hall of Fame ballot

	2024 votes	Percent	Year on ballot
Bobby Abreu	57	14.8	6th
Carlos Beltran	220	57.1	3rd
Mark Buehrle	32	8.3	5th
Carlos Gonzalez			1st
Curtis Granderson			1st
Felix Hernandez			1st
Torii Hunter	28	7.3	5th
Adam Jones			1st
Andruw Jones	237	61.6	8th
Ian Kinsler			1st
Russell Martin			1st
Brian McCann			1st
Dustin Pedroia			1st
Andy Pettitte	52	13.5	7th
Hanley Ramirez			1st
Manny Ramirez	125	32.5	9th
Fernando Rodney			1st
Alex Rodriguez	134	34.8	4th
Francisco Rodriguez	30	7.8	3rd
Jimmy Rollins	57	14.8	4th
CC Sabathia			1st
Ichiro Suzuki			1st
Troy Tulowitzki			1st
Chase Utley	111	28.8	2nd
Omar Vizquel	68	17.7	8th
Billy Wagner	284	73.8	10th
David Wright	24	6.2	2nd
Ben Zobrist			1st

[Drizzay 675]

That first time ballot list is pitiful, except for Ichiro.

Ichiro

Andruw Jones

 

That is all I got

[Hardcore troubadour 14,164]

Omar  Vizquel only getting 17 pct.  Most of  these writers should have done more watching than reading. 

[thegeneral 2,496]

Ichiro. Will he be unanimous?  

[Mike Honcho 4,731]

1 minute ago, thegeneral said:

Ichiro. Will he be unanimous?  

We should bet on how many writers keep him off...I'll say 4

[thegeneral 2,496]

6 minutes ago, Mike Honcho said:

We should bet on how many writers keep him off...I'll say 4

There will be a few. But it’s crazy. This guy was one of best of his generation. So much fun to watch him play, could do it all.

[cmh6476 918]

What's the percent threshold? And are most of the carryover getting more or less votes in subsequent year's?

[Death 143]

Pete Rose should have been on this. Focking baseball writers.

[Gepetto 1,192]

51 minutes ago, cmh6476 said:

What's the percent threshold? And are most of the carryover getting more or less votes in subsequent year's?

75%

more

[thegeneral 2,496]

59 minutes ago, Death said:

Pete Rose should have been on this. Focking baseball writers.

I see both sides of this. I’d have him in there after the likes of Bonds, Clemens, ARod, etc though. 

[Death 143]

14 minutes ago, thegeneral said:

I see both sides of this. I’d have him in there after the likes of Bonds, Clemens, ARod, etc though. 

I don't think you can can compare his player stats to those of the juicers.

Now that he's dead, he belongs in the Hall for what he did on the field.

[posty 2,491]

1 hour ago, Death said:

Pete Rose should have been on this. Focking baseball writers.

Nope…. He shouldn’t get in until after Shoeless Joe gets in and Rose then waits as long as Jackson had to wait (if he does get in)…

Plus the writers didn’t ban him from baseball, Major League Baseball did…

[thegeneral 2,496]

6 minutes ago, Death said:

I don't think you can can compare his player stats to those of the juicers.

Now that he's dead, he belongs in the Hall for what he did on the field.

For me the gambling thing is integral to the sport. People juicing up wasn’t even illegal in the sport at the time.

[posty 2,491]

1 hour ago, thegeneral said:

Ichiro. Will he be unanimous?  

He should, but I doubt he will be unanimous…. Rivera still shouldn’t have been the first one…

[thegeneral 2,496]

30 minutes ago, posty said:

He should, but I doubt he will be unanimous…. Rivera still shouldn’t have been the first one…

Probably won’t be…there’s always a few that like to be jackasses

[Gepetto 1,192]

I just think it weakens the Baseball Hall by not having Pete Rose, Shoeless Joe, McGwire, Manny Ramirez, Clemens, Bonds, and even Palmeiro and Sosa in. Bagwell, Ortiz and Pudge likely juiced.

[RaiderHaters Revenge 4,051]

I think any writer who doesn't vote a guy in that receives 90% of the vote, should lose their right to vote for life

also Ichiro only

and a guy should only get 2 shots to be voted in, First 5 years after retiring, 2nd 10 years by the committee

if you aren't a first ballot HOF you shouldn't be in

 

[Mark Davis 280]

Wagner likely makes it in.  Super nice guy, saw him frequently in Jackson MS in the minors.  He was actually a starter back then.  As good as he was, his career numbers would have been much better if not for elbow issues.  He managed to squeeze more years out of that arm after I thought he was done.

[Mark Davis 280]

4 hours ago, Gepetto said:

I just think it weakens the Baseball Hall by not having Pete Rose, Shoeless Joe, McGwire, Manny Ramirez, Clemens, Bonds, and even Palmeiro and Sosa in. Bagwell, Ortiz and Pudge likely juiced.

The predominant thought around the parks at that time was for sure Bagwell did.  There were a lot of other guys too, but it's foolish for anyone to think the guys voted in were all clean.  My personal belief is that you are probably right on the three you  mentioned and I'd add Piazza as well to that suspicion.  There's no way to know, so it's useless.  But the sport looked the other way at the time due to the money.  ARod, Bonds, Clemens, etc don't flourish without tacit approval from the teams and MLB.  They were the dominant players of their era.  I feel they should be in and if there's any shame on it, it should be on MLB.  Bonds and Clemens were likely HOF caliber before those mid-90s years.

[Gepetto 1,192]

19 minutes ago, Mark Davis said:

The predominant thought around the parks at that time was for sure Bagwell did.  There were a lot of other guys too, but it's foolish for anyone to think the guys voted in were all clean.  My personal belief is that you are probably right on the three you  mentioned and I'd add Piazza as well to that suspicion.  There's no way to know, so it's useless.  But the sport looked the other way at the time due to the money.  ARod, Bonds, Clemens, etc don't flourish without tacit approval from the teams and MLB.  They were the dominant players of their era.  I feel they should be in and if there's any shame on it, it should be on MLB.  Bonds and Clemens were likely HOF caliber before those mid-90s years.

Agree on Piazza suspicions. Also, agree A-Rod is HOF worthy. Also, steroids wasn't even against the rules of baseball and once it was, who cares, there are mandatory suspensions put in place. It shouldn't be exclusion from the HOF. There are some HOF Voters that have been voting for these guys at least. Bonds and Pete Rose and Clemens and Shoeless Joe are bigger than the HOF, as are Sosa and McGwire who saved baseball and made it fun to watch. Bonds was fun to watch for sure. He was in a zone.

[Hardcore troubadour 14,164]

6 minutes ago, Gepetto said:

Agree on Piazza suspicions. Also, agree A-Rod is HOF worthy. Also, steroids wasn't even against the rules of baseball and once it was, who cares, there are mandatory suspensions put in place. It shouldn't be exclusion from the HOF. There are some HOF Voters that have been voting for these guys at least. Bonds and Pete Rose and Clemens and Shoeless Joe are bigger than the HOF, as are Sosa and McGwire who saved baseball and made it fun to watch. Bonds was fun to watch for sure. He was in a zone.

What did they save baseball from? Attendance had increased for three consecutive years prior to 98. 

[Gepetto 1,192]

1 minute ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

What did they save baseball from? Attendance had increased for three consecutive years prior to 98. 

They started saving it at in the early to mid-90s. 1980s was the dead ball era.

[Kopy 534]

10 hours ago, Drizzay said:

That first time ballot list is pitiful, except for Ichiro.

Ichiro

Andruw Jones

 

That is all I got

And Wagner.

 

[Mike Honcho 4,731]

14 hours ago, posty said:

He should, but I doubt he will be unanimous…. Rivera still shouldn’t have been the first one…

I'm not a historian, but I think a good case could be made that a few of these guys should have been unanimous.  

• Ty Cobb: Center fielder who received the most votes in the inaugural election
• Babe Ruth: Right fielder
• Honus Wagner: Shortstop
• Christy Mathewson: Pitcher
• Walter Johnson: Pitcher 

[Mike Honcho 4,731]

Also, I'd vote for CC.  It's going to be difficult to compare pitchers in this era to past because of game changes, but a Cy Young, best pitcher on a WS winning team(2009 Yankees), 3000K +, dominance for quite a long time in the game.  

[posty 2,491]

Just now, Mike Honcho said:

I'm not a historian, but I think a good case could be made that a few of these guys should have been unanimous.  

• Ty Cobb: Center fielder who received the most votes in the inaugural election
• Babe Ruth: Right fielder
• Honus Wagner: Shortstop
• Christy Mathewson: Pitcher
• Walter Johnson: Pitcher 

You have to remember that the HoF didn’t start until 1936, so a lot of players were eligible…. No wonder unanimous didn’t happen (first vote results):

https://www.baseball-reference.com/awards/hof_1936.shtml

[Mike Honcho 4,731]

14 hours ago, posty said:

Nope…. He shouldn’t get in until after Shoeless Joe gets in and Rose then waits as long as Jackson had to wait (if he does get in)…

Plus the writers didn’t ban him from baseball, Major League Baseball did…

And before that reinstate Buck Weaver. No where near a HOF player, but his ban is a stain baseball. 

[posty 2,491]

If I had a vote Ichiro for sure and probably Sabathia, but could see him falling short his first time on the ballot…. I would probably vote Wagner in as well….

[Hardcore troubadour 14,164]

If Billy Wagner gets in first ballot then The Great Mariano Rivera needs his own wing in the HOF. 

[Mike Honcho 4,731]

4 minutes ago, posty said:

You have to remember that the HoF didn’t start until 1936, so a lot of players were eligible…. No wonder unanimous didn’t happen (first vote results):

https://www.baseball-reference.com/awards/hof_1936.shtml

I'm just saying that maybe a guy who was up that year, how had 287 more career HR's than any other player, might have, maybe should have been a unanimous selection, considering they had 10 votes.  But at this point it's just silly how this has come about...Ruth only had 95.1%, 11 people left him off the list. 

[jerryskids 6,171]

I once heard the best definition of a HOFer -- can you tell the story of the game without him in it?  If so, he's not a HOFer.

Of the non-juicers on that list, Ichiro is the only one that fits that description to me.  Maybe CC.

But by that definition, you can't tell the story of the game without all the juicers who have been listed, who were the absolute best players of their times.  It's long past time the HOF adds a steroids wing and add these guys.  Young people should learn about this period, if for no other reason than to avoid making similar mistakes in the future. 

 

[Mike Honcho 4,731]

2 minutes ago, jerryskids said:

I once heard the best definition of a HOFer -- can you tell the story of the game without him in it?  If so, he's not a HOFer.

Of the non-juicers on that list, Ichiro is the only one that fits that description to me.  Maybe CC.

But by that definition, you can't tell the story of the game without all the juicers who have been listed, who were the absolute best players of their times.  It's long past time the HOF adds a steroids wing and add these guys.  Young people should learn about this period, if for no other reason than to avoid making similar mistakes in the future. 

 

My stance is these players are supposed to be the hero's of the game(and I'm not getting into a debate about the racist Ty Cobb today)...and the hero's of the game don't go to a dark part of the gym to find a guy to sell them illegal drugs to boost their careers.  I think a young baseball fan can look at the all-time leaders like Bonds, Clemons and it won't take them long to "learn" why these 'greats' are not in the HOF.  I get where others are coming from but that's my 2 cents and it has been since the beginning.  

[HellToupee 1,254]

The juicers should get in before Rose. Just my opinion 

[thegeneral 2,496]

14 minutes ago, HellToupee said:

The juicers should get in before Rose. Just my opinion 

[posty 2,491]

21 minutes ago, HellToupee said:

The juicers should get in before Rose. Just my opinion 

Definitely, but Rose should never get in…. Unless Shoeless Joe gets in first and Rose waits as long…. It is only fair…

[Mark Davis 280]

9 hours ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

If Billy Wagner gets in first ballot then The Great Mariano Rivera needs his own wing in the HOF. 

It's Wagner's last year of eligibility.  He's been steadily building support so I think he gets in this year but this is his last shot from the writers.

[Hardcore troubadour 14,164]

5 minutes ago, Mark Davis said:

It's Wagner's last year of eligibility.  He's been steadily building support so I think he gets in this year but this is his last shot from the writers.

That too! lol. 

[edjr 6,306]

Hall of sham. No one cares anymore. 

[Alias Detective 1,313]

Manny, Aroid and itchy roe

[cmh6476 918]

Do catchers get the shaft?  Since the HOF is timely I'm monitoring some discussion on if Salvy would go when he's eligible, but it seems like there are a bunch of noteworthy catchers who don't make the cut.  Just cutting and pasting some of the back and forth:
 

Quote

Salvy gets absolutely killed on WAR due to his lack of BB’s and pitch framing. But he’s been mostly excellent in every other category. He lost 2019 to injury. Lost most of 2020 to Covid, though he was a beast when he played.

The writers have notoriously made catchers wait or simply be held to a criteria that doesn’t make any sense. In 150 years of baseball, we’ve got 17 catchers in the HOF. That’s ****ing ridiculous. One catcher gets in, on average every nine years.

If Salvy simply had 300 more BB’s right now, in turn pumping up a few other stats, runs, OBP, OPS, etc…. He might already be a lock after another year of quality play. He’s got plenty of hardware. Nine AS selections; six as the starter, five GG’s, five SS’s, various off field awards, WS MVP. He has the most homers ever in a season at 48, he’s been enormously popular among everyone throughout and outside of baseball.

But I don’t think any of that is enough, unfortunately.

Quote

I agree. He's ninth with 273 HR among players that spent most of their careers at catcher. If Perez moves past Lance Parrish (fifth with 324 HR), he would be in a top five in career HR with a group that includes Mike Piazza, Carlton Fisk, Johnny Bench and Yogi Berra. Berra has 336 HR.

This year's ballot will be interesting because Russell Martin (28th all-time catcher in Jay Jaffe's ranking system) and Brian McCann (35th all-time) are debuting on the ballot. Salvador Perez is 32nd overall. I think it's going to be tough for McCann and Martin, but I'm curious if either one gets the minimum 5% and stays on the ballot.

That's what Sal is going to have to do, stay on the ballot and remain in the conversation and hope that his case generates momentum during the 10-year window he's on the writer's ballot.

There's some good names on Perez's top 10 most similar like Hall of Famers Roy Campanella and Joe Gordon, future Hall of Famer Buster Posey, Francisco Lindor and guys like Bill Freehan and Jorge Posada who just miss the HOF cut. Freehan is an overlooked 1960s catcher that should probably be in.

Perez's Hall of Fame monitor is 81, the likely Hall of Famer is 100, so he's building a case.